With regard to the quotes below: Hundreds of millions of Europeans would DISAGREE with that specific Muslim belief, given that Islam took over (through severe & endless warfare) almost ALL of OUR (non-Islamic) countries & territories throughout history. Furthermore, there is currently a Christian Genocide throughout ALL of the Middle East (with ISRAEL as the ONLY exception) & Africa (and wherever Islam exists), and Iran, as an eample, had over 1.4 million Christians 15-20 years ago; it now has less than 200,000... and other countries that had high percentages of Christians now have 50-2,000 remaining with everything stolen from them, their homes, money, jewels, clothes, taken in by ISRAEL, the only democracy in all of the Middle East.
It is shocking the number of words (and ideas) you insert into 2:191 ("... Kill them wherever you find them..."). I am certain that IF Muhammad meant what YOU write, then HE would have written what you write and NOT what is in the Koran.
Oddly enough, you did not try to rationalize the section where Islam instructs the Muslim to KILL NON-BELIEVERS after giving them a chance to CONVERT... and, if they don't, then kill the infidels.
By the way, we (those of us who live in the USA) can NO LONGER say whatever we wish; to the contrary, exclusively BECAUSE OF ISLAM, our "freedom of speech" has been heavily curtailed and (just like in Europe) any TRUTH we write (even direct quotes) are labeled as "HATE SPEECH"... just as they were in Nazi Germany before WWII began.
What follows is simply a quote from this page to which I'd referred (followed by a brief comment).
"Imam Muhammad al-Ghazali writes his commentary on Surah 9:
“Muslims are therefore basically opposed to war and are never the ones to start it. By the imperative of their own religion, they are taught not to impose their beliefs on others by force. Their mission is to impart and communicate God’s message, leaving people free to decide whether to believe or reject it. Those who refuse to believe are free to pursue their lives in peace as long as they do not pose any obstacle or threat to Islam and the Muslims, who perceiv..."
I'm sorry, but this is a JOKE, given today's global Christian Genocide, the endless Islamic terrorism... and ALL of history.
@Mohammed Rafiq Lodhia; I think secular
logic refers the following versus. Sultan Sahin repeatedly says that 7th
century contextual instructions do not apply to us any more in the 21st century
The article cited above discusses 8:36 to 8:38 which are almost identical to 2:190 to 2:193 and shows how various translators have erred and misled the people. The error of these translators is verifiable by anyone who cares to learn the truth. It is a different matter that some of these are the major influencers of the various sects and have contributed in a large measure to the development of a theology which is against the clear meaning of the Quran.
The article cited above discusses the verses of Surah Taubah etc. and the commandments of Allah regarding fighting.
These articles clearly bring out the meaning of fighting in the cause of Allah and show that fighting the Muslim oppressors (such as the ISIS) would be fighting in the cause of Allah and incumbent on rulers who are in a position to wage war against it. Kafir has been used for deliberate and willful deniers of the truth but in practical terms only for the oppressors. In practice therefore, only oppressors are kafirs who must be resisted/fought against irrespective of the faith that they profess with their mouths.
In particular, there is no verse in the Quran that allows war because of the faith professed by the other party. Fighting is permitted against only the oppressors and none else. This is brought out clearly in both the articles.
Mr Nilamani Tripathy,
Thanks for reading this article. In
your comment you asked me to explain the following verses of the Quran. But you
did not mention the verses. Where are the verses? Please quote them.
Shahin – Editor – New Age Islam
be kind to elaborate as to what “Secular Logic,” meant by stating that, “Mohammad said enough evil things.”
Why not stretch your mind a little? Of course, “Secular Logic,”
must have read something which made him to give his own verdict about the
Prophet of Islam.
After all, there has to be an end to the madness that goes on
and on and on in the New Age Islam forum. Where is your “Self-Esteem,”
Sultan Shahin Saheb? Are you mapping new agenda for Muslims in the 21st
century, or are you conspiring to side with the Islam haters and Muslim bashers?
Mohammed Rafiq Lodhia
Sultan Shahin Saheb,
believing that the “Stretching Of Minds,” can
take place by reading the comments of “Secular Logic,” henceforth, I
earnestly request you to take up the challenge of what this mysterious person
demands, “You will have to reject a lot of the verses if you are to
live in harmony with the world.” Go ahead and make our day, Sultan Shahin
Naseer Ahmed, and also, Ziaur Rehman must now team up with “Secular Logic,”
and write a book about which verses of the Holy Qur’an to reject. My mind points
to one single fact, that is, the bigoted person is overwhelmingly obsessed with
Islam. Why not just put his mind at ease? Therefore, before publishing the book,
be sure to mention the person’s “Real Name.” Never mind, the jibber
jabber of “Ex-Tablighi.” This “Tablighi Jamaat” man believes in “Hide &
game, just like the rest of the bearded buffoons who are on a killing spree by
hiding their real faces.
face it, this way, the question of “spiritually unclean,” and “jizya,”
can permanently be settled. You should not have any problem, as you continue to
encourage that such debates must go on with no end in sight. Carry on reading
all the bigoted views. Keep in mind another one of the hidden person’s remarks:
“The world doesn't have a hope of ever being free of this
Yes, everything is allowed under the guise of “Freedom of Speech.”
Now, let’s see if you can help fulfill the dream of the so-called malicious
person, Sultan Saheb.
pointed question to you is, “Hasn’t there been enough of ‘Stretching of
Minds’?” I say, it is high time for you, to co-author a book, in
which, you should give guidelines to your fellow Muslims, as to what “Secular
Logic,” desires. I say, take a bold step forward so that those who admire
you will eventually be mighty proud of you to finally let the Muslims map the
new agenda for the 21st century.
the way, “Hats Off” and “Curious Traveler,” can also help in
compiling the book. These two characters can most certainly help in pulling out
plenty of references from the internet. Then again, let’s not forget that there
can well be plenty of shady and unknown characters in your forum who can
contribute in rejecting whatever Qur’anic verses which seems to be bothering
them too. Why not? It is your fanatical belief that only by continuously
reading viscous comments of those who engages in smearing Islam and insulting Qur’an
will help the “Stretching of Minds,” for the Muslims. Go ahead and
make our day, Sultan Shahin Saheb.
Sultan Shahin sahib, let us then write more about our rejection of "7th century contextual instructions". Is "rejection" too strong a word?
Not if Muslims accepted and said loudly and repeatedly that 7th century contextual instructions do not apply to us any more in the 21st century. Do we have a choice, Ghulam Mohiyuddin Saheb, in the constantly degrading situation.
However, we should accept the present inapplicability of the 7th-century contextual directives only if we really develop this conviction and come to believe this. It should not be part of a taqaiyya. Only with a well-thought out consensus in the community, we will be able to sustain this belief. However, since we don't have a consensus now, we should keep trying and keep expressing our thoughts from every available platform.